Template talk:Country topics

Issues Include link to WikiProject? Include any external links (i.e. to the Commons)? Use an "above" line for the Outline / Index (/ Bibliography) links or list them with the Book / Category / etc links in the "below" line? Fix list backgrounds alternation.

Countries Template‑class

This template is within the scope of WikiProject Countries, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of countries on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.CountriesWikipedia:WikiProject CountriesTemplate:WikiProject Countriescountry articles Template This template does not require a rating on Wikipedia's content assessment scale. WikiProject Countries to-do list: edit history watch purge Here are some tasks awaiting attention: Article requests : Check out the article alerts; see if anything catches your fancy. Cleanup : clean-up listing for Countries Stubs : de-stub articles in Category:Stubs by region. Other : add {{WPCountries}} to talk pages of related articles, and assess.

Hi, just a stylistic quibble about the (great) new country template.

It looks perfect on the blank template page.

In operation though, I can't see the faint zebra-stripes/watermark (gray, white, gray, white) in the white-space background that helps people visually keep track of what sub-section they are looking across.

For example, on the Ecuador topics page. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Ecuador_topics

I can see one grey-shaded bar at the bottom (across the culture subsection), but all the rest of the background shows up white.

I hope this makes sense!

Thank you, 0Juniper56 (talk) 07:00, 6 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for your message, 0Juniper56. I think what you're reporting might be an unforeseen side-effect of the way the groups of links are numbered: not consecutively, to allow the occasional insertion of a custom group or two. But that means the alternation between odd and even-numbered groups mostly disappears – and hence, I'm guessing, the desired zebra-striping with it. So, I've just tried amending the template to avoid that (although not always eliminate it); any difference / improvement where you are? CsDix (talk) 15:42, 6 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

zebra-stripes are possible, but it would be somewhat painful. basically, we would have to use the same numeric shift operation used in the first few rows, but for all the groups/lists. if it is really really important, I can make it work, but I would rather not :) Frietjes (talk) 21:34, 6 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed -- but I'm hoping the amendment (workaround, fudge) I made will suffice 90% or more of the time. Let's see if/when 0Juniper56 reports back. CsDix (talk) 16:04, 7 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

In Template:Macedonia topics, to fix a link to a disambiguation page, I changed the titlename to Republic of Macedonia and added the prefix "the". Even though Template:Country data Republic of Macedonia exists as a redirect, the flag doesn't show up because the flag is at File:Flag of Macedonia.svg, not File:Flag of the Republic of Macedonia.svg. I'm not sure what the best way to modify looking for the appropriate flagicon would be. Alternatively, a flaglink parameter could be added (and I'm clueless regarding the alt text) so the flag would link to Republic of Macedonia instead of Flag of Macedonia when the flagname parameter is used. TimBentley (talk) 21:51, 16 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Well, redirects aren't working, so we should probably ask for the flag to be moved. There's no reason it shouldn't be in line with the country article. CMD (talk) 04:30, 17 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know why, but the flag is appearing now. I guess we just had to wait a few hours for the file redirect to work. TimBentley (talk) 13:38, 17 December 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I have restored the parameters for a WikiProject. I believe that a wider discussion should take place before its removed - as it has been the norm in templates for years. I agree we have some policies that discourages this type of link, but it is the norm and these projects should not be hidden if the rest our projects are visible in this fashion. It was one of the proposed solution for making projects more visible - (will look for this discussion).17:53, 5 January 2013 (UTC)

wow, you royally screwed up the template, nice work! if you look at the diff, you did not just "restore the parameters for a WikiProject". I have reverted your vandalism. Frietjes (talk) 19:24, 5 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

WOW very disappointing to see my good faith edit called vandalism - we have basic conduct expectations here - in the future pls try and give a proper evaluation of the situation. Now to the matter at hand - the parameter is the norm so why is it removed.Moxy (talk) 19:27, 5 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

yes, the template should be fully protected to prevent editors who don't understand it from screwing it up. I would expect an experience editor to not engage is such reckless conduct. Frietjes (talk) 19:29, 5 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Perhaps you can explain the problem instead of more insults - do you have an opinion of the matter at hand?Moxy (talk) 19:34, 5 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

perhaps since you are so experienced, you can explain how your edit only added a WikiProject link? Frietjes (talk) 19:37, 5 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

All was working fine from what I can see - no errors same format that was there for a long time - pls explain the problem. Do you have an opinion of the matter at hand at all? Pls stop with the personal comments Moxy (talk) 19:40, 5 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

all was not working fine, until I fixed it, explaining it to you would be pointless since it appears you cannot read the diff from your edit. however, if you really want to know why your edit screwed up the template, I will try to explain it to you in simple terms. Frietjes (talk) 16:49, 6 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

since you seem to be so interested in understanding why your edits are so damaging, let's look at all your changes

1. you changed {{{country|{{{territory|{{{region|{{{titlename}}}}}}}}}}}} to {{{titlename|{{{country|{{{territory|{{{region}}}}}}}}}}}} in many places. why did you feel the need to make this change? the parameter order in this construct is very important. we only want to use the value for "titlename" first for the edit links, not in other places in the template where we want to use the value for either country, territory, or region first.
2. you changed |list{{#if:{{{geography|}}}{{{list2|}}}{{{history|}}}{{{list1|}}}|5|1}} = {{{list3|}}} to |list5 = {{{list3|}}}. why did you feel as though this list renumbering code was unnecessary? you see we must have list1 if we want the image to appear at the right. do you think we don't need this feature? if you want to remove the images, then there are easier ways to do that.
3. you changed |list{{#if:{{{list3|}}}{{{geography|}}}{{{list2|}}}{{{history|}}}{{{list1|}}}|6|1}} = to |list6 =. again, I don't understand why you thought this list renumbering code was unnecessary.

if, as you say, your only problem was with this edit, then you should have undone this edit, and asked the editor who made that edit to discuss it. assuming that all the other edits after that edit were pointless is an incredible lack of assuming good faith. Frietjes (talk) 17:01, 6 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Great explanation - I understand your points - your right I coould have just reverted that one edit - I see now - that was not hard was it.Moxy (talk) 17:23, 6 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Could the outline and index be moved to the below line (with the portal, etc) to save a line? Putting them on a line by themselves at the top seems undue prominence. Kanguole 18:43, 7 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

• That could be an improvement, although I'd be inclined to give them a line of their own in the "below" area, like this:

...or maybe their own separate "pre-below" line, like this:

Thoughts? CsDix (talk) 08:27, 8 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Still seems like undue prominence to me. For comparison, I was suggesting

Kanguole 09:08, 8 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

• Ah, I see... Yes, that could work – except do you think there now might be a tendency toward too many icons in the "below" line..?

(For sake of comparison:)

CsDix (talk) 12:04, 8 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, I agree that the icons aren't necessary. I'd also agree with Chipmunkdavis that WikiProject links don't belong in navigation targeted at readers[1]. Kanguole 12:24, 8 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

• I've now moved the Outline/Index links down to the below line and disabled the icons, but haven't disabled the WikiProject link as I'm not sure there's consensus to do so. (There may not be consensus about the Outline/Index links' new position either, but let's see what happens.) But disable the link (to see what happens) if you wish. Thanks for your input. CsDix (talk) 23:40, 8 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Template form

• Sorry coming to this conversation late I guess. :-( The below section in most templates are used for non-article destination links within Wikipedia like Cats, Books, Portals and projects pages that all have there own named tabs (Its also used to link to wiki sister pages to my dismay and against policy) - two examples below of the norm. Indexes, Outlines and Bibliographies (that is missing here) are main article pages used for direct article navigation. See our most seen country template Template:United States topics or any another should not be converted to this template without discussion at each template there are reasons projects opt out of using generic templates like with Template:Canada topics that was a very long debate on those horrible colors that in my opinion are the opposite of our policy on the matter etc.).Moxy (talk) 03:16, 9 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]